One last shot... Breaking up!

thunderace31

thunderace31

New member
Re: One last shot... Breaking up!

BoostedSUV said:
Rob it was based on that 'june 14" DM file that Nolan told me me injectors are maxed out and I can't go any higher with boost if I wanted to run meth or race gas. Either way I have low Z injectors in my truck and my ECM isn't modded for them so I'm going to change them. I am definitely going to take apart the AFPR and check it while I have it all apart. :tup:
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From my experiences with GN's if you dont mod the ecm for a low Z inj. the computer will do strange things and missing and going lean is one of them. You may have messed up the ecm also as it will burn the inj. drives up quick. I had a fuel pressure reg. go bad all my issues were going lean under boost not at any other rpm do to a ripped diaphragm .
 
SloGN

SloGN

9Sec Alky V6
Re: One last shot... Breaking up!

thunderace31 said:
From my experiences with GN's if you dont mod the ecm for a low Z inj. the computer will do strange things and missing and going lean is one of them. You may have messed up the ecm also as it will burn the inj. drives up quick. I had a fuel pressure reg. go bad all my issues were going lean under boost not at any other rpm do to a ripped diaphragm .
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Generally the Ecm will run the low impedance inj just fine. When the drivers in the ecm go bad they simply just burn up and quite and will make the car skip with a dead hole.

My gn has had low impedance inj in it for yrs on a stock ecm. I had the 55's in it for several yrs then i switched to the 72's. The biggest issue is the ecm does generate more heat. i also added a ground to the ecm.

I keep a spare ecm in the trunk as i know running the low impedance inj is not good on it and it will fail anytime.


I got a good one for ya tho:)

When i bought my 72's from a guy they came with a modded ecm (quad air modded it) when i use that ecm in my GN it show stupid amounts of knock retard even @ 14-15 psi of boost. i'm talking like 20-30 degrees and the checking engine light will flash very quickly when you go WOT. so i went back to the trusty stocker till i get my FAST system back and reinstall it in the car!
 
thunderace31

thunderace31

New member
Re: One last shot... Breaking up!

SloGN said:
Generally the Ecm will run the low impedance inj just fine. When the drivers in the ecm go bad they simply just burn up and quite and will make the car skip with a dead hole.

My gn has had low impedance inj in it for yrs on a stock ecm. I had the 55's in it for several yrs then i switched to the 72's. The biggest issue is the ecm does generate more heat. i also added a ground to the ecm.

I keep a spare ecm in the trunk as i know running the low impedance inj is not good on it and it will fail anytime.


I got a good one for ya tho:)

When i bought my 72's from a guy they came with a modded ecm (quad air modded it) when i use that ecm in my GN it show stupid amounts of knock retard even @ 14-15 psi of boost. i'm talking like 20-30 degrees and the checking engine light will flash very quickly when you go WOT. so i went back to the trusty stocker till i get my FAST system back and reinstall it in the car!
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Lets stop talking about GN's as he has a Typhoon and from what Im gathering on this site the ECM's are no where near the same. All I know is I had issues with Low z in one of my cars and have always run the High Z's in it without issues. Now are the injectors the same for a GN and a Typhoon or Sy ? If so that makes life 200 times easier for me anyway :)
Sorry for hijacking your thread here also I really hope this is your issue and you get it sorted out soon :)
 
BoostedSUV

BoostedSUV

Active member
Re: One last shot... Breaking up!

thunderace31 said:
Lets stop talking about GN's as he has a Typhoon and from what Im gathering on this site the ECM's are no where near the same. All I know is I had issues with Low z in one of my cars and have always run the High Z's in it without issues. Now are the injectors the same for a GN and a Typhoon or Sy ? If so that makes life 200 times easier for me anyway :)
Sorry for hijacking your thread here also I really hope this is your issue and you get it sorted out soon :)
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:lol: there's a lot of good information on this thread so hijack away! I can answer that question though... GN's and sy/tys use the same style injector. Not sure if stock to stock they're rated the same but the injectors are interchangable. I was talking to Raist103 (another GN guru) about buying 65s from him that came out of a GN. So basically yes, they use the same injector and can be interchanged. :tup:
 
thunderace31

thunderace31

New member
Re: One last shot... Breaking up!

Cool I have a set of 60's from my GN when we went up to the new 80's and they looked about the same just wanted to make sure :)
THANKS!
 
turbodig

turbodig

Active member
Re: One last shot... Breaking up!

TYTILIDIE said:
Well thats good to know. When I was choosing and injector for my build I decided 75's were my best bet. I was told by pretty much every one to stick with lowz. What brand are the 80's? Same as the 75's but 80? Im sure you know what Im getting at.
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The 80s are Mototron/Siemens as well. They seem to behave quite nicely at low PW (idle/cruise).
And they spray *lots* of fuel. We had to take the F77x table below 1.00 in a large chunk of the boost table.

I'd put these in *long* before I'd mess with low-z. Only reason for low-z at this point is if you need > 83# hr, which sorta means that you're in the big power league and will likely have an aftermarket ECU.

They'd also be a good choice for E85 guys up to the high 10s.
 
SloGN

SloGN

9Sec Alky V6
Re: One last shot... Breaking up!

well from what i have seen the delphi/seimans inj seem to be off. regardless of what they are flow matched. Trust me know the the inj are what they say there are it makes tuning a heck of a lot easier.


I need to learn the syty stuff.


Turbodig what programs for editing the stock bin files is best. i have win bin.
 
BoostedSUV

BoostedSUV

Active member
Re: One last shot... Breaking up!

I'm looking at a set of Racetronix 66lbs/hr high Z injectors. $330 for the flow matched ser of 6 is a good price! Probably going to order those tonight unless someone chimes in otherwise. My truck is a daily driver with some alky spray, probably good for low 12s-high 11s. I think those should support my build sufficiently. :tup:
 
thunderace31

thunderace31

New member
Re: One last shot... Breaking up!

SloGN said:
well from what i have seen the delphi/seimans inj seem to be off. regardless of what they are flow matched. Trust me know the the inj are what they say there are it makes tuning a heck of a lot easier.


I need to learn the syty stuff.


Turbodig what programs for editing the stock bin files is best. i have win bin.
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I have not had an issue with them at all in the GN even the 80's work really well and Im happy with them. Dont see why they would be any difference in a Ty ??
 
WyoSyclone

WyoSyclone

Active member
Re: One last shot... Breaking up!

BoostedSUV said:
Rob it was based on that 'june 14" DM file that Nolan told me me injectors are maxed out and I can't go any higher with boost if I wanted to run meth or race gas. Either way I have low Z injectors in my truck and my ECM isn't modded for them so I'm going to change them. I am definitely going to take apart the AFPR and check it while I have it all apart. :tup:
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I went back and checked that run, and there are a few frames where you run up to 104% inj DC (at 5100 rpm) .... so you would be maxed out for your present setup....although it probably isn't causing the issue you're seeing now... looking at the 'plx' run, your issued commands for inj DC are smooth throughout those RPM ranges where the breakup is occuring. You did swap ECMs, and the problem remained, which still has me pointing to a mechanical issue.
Looks like you'll need the new injectors for future changes, so at least you'll have that task out of the way :tup: .... of course, you'll have to change your tune once they're in. To keep things simple I'd sure check that AFPR before you put the new injectors in - otherwise you'd be compounding your problems (new tune needed plus old stuttering problem).
 
SloGN

SloGN

9Sec Alky V6
Re: One last shot... Breaking up!

thunderace31 said:
I have not had an issue with them at all in the GN even the 80's work really well and Im happy with them. Dont see why they would be any difference in a Ty ??
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i'm not talking about them being in the TY. I'm saying any inj should be flowed to make sure they are what the vendor says they are.


every inj that i have installed in my cars or friends. i have them flowed to make sure they are correct to save me time.

Tuning for a undersized inj or over sized inj can be hell.....................
 
thunderace31

thunderace31

New member
Re: One last shot... Breaking up!

SloGN said:
i'm not talking about them being in the TY. I'm saying any inj should be flowed to make sure they are what the vendor says they are.


every inj that i have installed in my cars or friends. i have them flowed to make sure they are correct to save me time.

Tuning for a undersized inj or over sized inj can be hell.....................
Click to expand...


AHHH Yes your right I only buy them in matched sets :) thats the best way to do it :)
 
BoostedSUV

BoostedSUV

Active member
Re: One last shot... Breaking up!

Well I took the injectors out of my truck and I was wrong about them being low Z injectors. They are Delphi 50lbs/hour high Z injectors, they're part # 17113738.

Anyways, everything visibly looked good. All the o-rings were seated properly on the injectors as well as the AFPR. I took apart the AFPR to check that and every things good. There isn't much to it, just a spring and a diaphragm. Everything moved freely and nothing was bound up. Guess I will order the new injectors right now...
 
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BoostedSUV

BoostedSUV

Active member
Re: One last shot... Breaking up!

SloGN said:
would you like me to flow them and see if they show any problems related to your issues.
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Are you refering to the old ones? The new ones I just purchased are flow matched to within 1%.

I would love to get the old ones checked to verify if they are good or not. If they are a problem the I will I know, and if they're not a problem I can be confident and comfortable selling them to someone who needs them.
 
T

turboj91

New member
Re: One last shot... Breaking up!

SloGN said:
would you like me to flow them and see if they show any problems related to your issues.
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How would you flow them? If it is just for max flow (running static) like they do to match them, then the test is worthless. He has no issues at WOT under boost so they flow great running static.

If you have the ability to check their progressive flow and response time, now were talkin.

If when he makes the change and the problem goes away, you would know that they had a problem of some type. I have my theories but am quiet til the end.
 
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