Power is back

[Nova67ss]

Re: Power is back

i'm guessing adjustable shocks front and rear. w/ coil overs in the front right? you still have leaf springs in the back or did you four/three link it? that is a good point, treating it like a fwd setup and a rwd setup.

Yes, this info is also awailebly here on the forum but.. yes its coil overs in front and ladderbars with coilover in rear. a matter of fact, its a construction from one of the members here on the forum, bouth in front and rear.
Dont remember his name 6 o´clock in the morning after a nightshift. but its out on a thread some where.

 

[dgoodhue]

Re: Power is back

Yes, this info is also awailebly here on the forum but.. yes its coil overs in front and ladderbars with coilover in rear. a matter of fact, its a construction from one of the members here on the forum, bouth in front and rear.
Dont remember his name 6 o´clock in the morning after a nightshift. but its out on a thread some where.

He uses Dunstans Coilovers.

I agree the info is out their, I think the only thing he hasn't given out is his custom cam specs (he might even have given those out privately)

 

[fivetodrive]

Re: Power is back

i din't expect spring rates or anything. hell i run a ty so it wouldn't work for me anyways. at all. i'm just curious about a couple things. if you wanna say cool if not no biggie. i'm guessing adjustable shocks front and rear. w/ coil overs in the front right? you still have leaf springs in the back or did you four/three link it? that is a good point, treating it like a fwd setup and a rwd setup.

As for his rear suspention...I remember seeing some off shot pictures that made it look like it has a ladderbar type rear with coilover springs. But I can't find that picture anymore...

 

[Nova67ss]

Re: Power is back

He uses Dunstans Coilovers.

I agree the info is out their, I think the only thing he hasn't given out is his custom cam specs (he might even have given those out privately)

Thats right, the only spec´s that are a secret is cam spec´s, No they are not passed on to annyone els..

 

[Nova67ss]

Re: Power is back

As for his rear suspention...I remember seeing some off shot pictures that made it look like it has a ladderbar type rear with coilover springs. But I can't find that picture anymore...

Go to www.syclone.org and visit gallery U´ll find lots of pics on the most of Bad Ass.

 

[Tooky]

Re: Power is back

The talk about get to know what is done and so that Q is already ansvered on, Robert have been werry open and showed almost everything done to his Sy and engine thats alot more than anny have done on this forum, but as said on that thread: U have to go your way find whats workin in your combo... NO ONE will dropp every secret they know to another man.. try to get engine specs on a ferrarri F1 car or a nashcar or even Ur basic bracket race competitor, U get Zip.. I promice

Have you ever been to my website? Or seen My complete build sheet, with part numbers, sources, notes?

Aside from Robert not having anything comparable (let's see a link if I'm incorrect), I think what people really want to know is not how to build a copy of his truck, but what are the hard lessons he learned along the way?

For example:
1.) How strong precisely is a stock 4L80 with just a shift kit? To what HP/ET/MPH? Where exactly do they start burning up 2nd gear? What is the solution? Why would Robert choose to keep this info to himself?

2.) What exactly are the effects and pros/cons of running nitrous? How much does it increase HP compared to jet rating? How much does it "cool the charge"? Does running nitrous w/it's claimed "cooling effect" result in a net increase or decrease in the knock threshold for a given octane? How exactly does it affect boost control and spoolup spikes?

3.) What mods provide the biggest power gains? Head porting? Huge turbos at high boost? Intake swaps? Cam changes? Robert never posts these types of specifics. But that type of information is exactly the stuff that we can use to go fast with our own combinations. Perhaps that is the real reason he never shares them?

"NO ONE will dropp every secret" - Better check my site again, I posted all my custom chip calibrations from current and past combos, datalogs from them all, etc. My combo is 100 times more "copy-able" than a $$$,$$$ build, too.

I give it all away for free because I like to see SyTys run fast instead of owners scratching their heads or wasting money on mods that don't work. I also happen to believe that a group of people pooling their efforts together and trading information results in a benefit that greatly exceeds what one person can achieve working alone in isolation.

The purpose of this post is not to "advertise" for my site (which is all complete charity work/volunteering many hours on my part), but to show you that the standard for information sharing is quite a bit higher than what you perhaps thought it was. Posting timeslips and showing black marks or melted parts doesn't teach anybody how to go fast. Answering specific questions like I listed above or sharing the lessons learned, are what does.

 

[Nova67ss]

Re: Power is back

Strange U jump on Robert so hard on these Q, Robert eint a computor wiz and are not so interessted to build a super webb site will all recepies and cost´s on how much he spend on the truck, U´r site is nice and well informative U spend lots of time behind the computer, yes?

U could hardly expect him to tell U the 4L80e trans will hold 893½ Hp then burn? or secon cluths burns when U go WOT to fast? these wasPRANK ansvers.. I bet he dont even know for sure what to ansver himself. but he does speak with Rossler about trans, maybe U got all ansvers from him? Try.

When Hoovers was running fast we did ask them Q about the differens in setup and did´nt even get the size on the tires but U never asked HIM these specific Q... How come?

Q2, Nitrouse is a gamble when on turbo, thats my personal thinki´n get better stuff on engineparts instead.Manny race classes dont alow for 2 power adder so chose either Turbo- Nitrous-charger.

Q3, A huge turbo does not give annything without the good ported heads and a good single plane intake, Its the combo, Robert goes with low compresion (8,5:1) and Ed Hess goes with High compression (around 11:1) 2 schools deside what U belive is best than go with that, the $ is also a huge factor in this.. Speed costs money, how fast do U want to go??

 

[Tooky]

Re: Power is back

U could hardly expect him to tell U the 4L80e trans will hold 893½ Hp then burn? or secon cluths burns when U go WOT to fast? these wasPRANK ansvers.. I bet he dont even know for sure what to ansver himself. but he does speak with Rossler about trans, maybe U got all ansvers from him? Try.

OK then what was his fastest ET/MPH on 700R4? What was his fastest ET/MPH on his first basic 4L80? What ET/MPH did the 2nd gear clutches burn up?

When Hoovers was running fast we did ask them Q about the differens in setup and did´nt even get the size on the tires but U never asked HIM these specific Q... How come?

OK then Hoover were guilty of "hoarding secrets" too, then. I would like to ask them all the same questions. I think everyone on the forum should contribute their results (fast or slow) so everyone benefits from the wisdom of experience.

I singled you/Robert out here because you claimed "Robert have been werry open and showed almost everything done to his Sy and engine thats alot more than anny have done on this forum". Having the fastest truck and having tried so many different combos over the years, Robert is in the unique position of having perhaps the most experience. He must know by now which mods were a big success and which were useless failures, from all of his past/current combos. What does he stand to gain by withholding this information from everyone else?

 

[NecroWolf]

Re: Power is back

you know what everone says "what works on one truck won't neccisarily work on another" i have no problem with these guys keeping some of the details to themselves they spent the big dollars sorting it out, they've earned the right to decide what to share with the rest of us. i'm sure they have a large stash of parts that didn't work as good for them laying around. i have no problem sharing mine but i'm just dropping a salvage yard engine in and calling it good. these guys have more in their crank than i have in my entire build. i'm personally thankfull for what they do share and really don't want to know what they spent to get there because it's probably more than i make. tooky your build was equally as impressive to me because you showed how lowbuck a fast street build could be. though if i kept the stock computer and stock manifolds i bet my way would be about the same. yours worked for you mine works for me. and isn't the biggest secret tuning, tuning, tuning?

 

[Nova67ss]

Re: Power is back

OK then what was his fastest ET/MPH on 700R4? What was his fastest ET/MPH on his first basic 4L80? What ET/MPH did the 2nd gear clutches burn up?

OK then Hoover were guilty of "hoarding secrets" too, then. I would like to ask them all the same questions. I think everyone on the forum should contribute their results (fast or slow) so everyone benefits from the wisdom of experience.

I singled you/Robert out here because you claimed "Robert have been werry open and showed almost everything done to his Sy and engine thats alot more than anny have done on this forum". Having the fastest truck and having tried so many different combos over the years, Robert is in the unique position of having perhaps the most experience. He must know by now which mods were a big success and which were useless failures, from all of his past/current combos. What does he stand to gain by withholding this information from everyone else?

I leave this to Robert for answer, only he have the answers to this..

 

[mrsyclone]

Re: Power is back

OK then what was his fastest ET/MPH on 700R4? What was his fastest ET/MPH on his first basic 4L80? What ET/MPH did the 2nd gear clutches burn up?

OK then Hoover were guilty of "hoarding secrets" too, then. I would like to ask them all the same questions. I think everyone on the forum should contribute their results (fast or slow) so everyone benefits from the wisdom of experience.

I singled you/Robert out here because you claimed "Robert have been werry open and showed almost everything done to his Sy and engine thats alot more than anny have done on this forum". Having the fastest truck and having tried so many different combos over the years, Robert is in the unique position of having perhaps the most experience. He must know by now which mods were a big success and which were useless failures, from all of his past/current combos. What does he stand to gain by withholding this information from everyone else?

Fastest time 700R 10.22/143.5 mph

Fastes time on may first 4l80e 9.78/147mph same set up on motor like(700R)

What ET/MPH did the 2nd gear clutches burn up?
Low 9 150 mph +
but that problem is fixed now, and that is my secret
Hope this answer is gonna help you

 

[ed hess]

Re: Power is back

Guess i will add my 2 cents here.

1 I wont tell you my cam specs either.

2 If I had more time than i do Then i could write a book and post it up on making your syty fast.

3 Ask a question and you will get an answer. theres a few here that do this with me using pms.

4 Its tough when your at the top, everybody gets on your shit and i Guess like politics it puts you under the microscope. why? dont know and dont care.

5 I realize i havent posted much but then again I havent done anything results wise. have we been busy. Yes, many changes and issues to resolve. Hoefully they are behind us now for awhile. Have i posted them on the board. NO, I was more concerned about fixing them than discussing them.

6 Would i be bragging my ass off if i ran the number.
Wtf! what do you think? You gotta be kidding. You shitting me?
YOUR DAMN RIGHT!

7 THis stuff is a lot of hard work & damn expensive! So get off the guys back and let him enjoy what he has accomplished!
Remember bragging rights i all you recieve for your labor & money So Robert
Keep it up.

8 Keep it up, It may not last forever.

9, In reference to no 6 above, we've been thinking about a good headline when the bragging rights tables get turned.

10 Any quaestion?

ed

 

[Daron]

Re: Power is back

I am very disappointed. You all have it wrong. Robert is a wonderful SyTy ambassador and you guys bust his balls for not "sharing?" Maybe some sort of penis envy going on here...

I bet his deal is as simple as time management. With limited time/resources I would choose to spend both on my truck, not online. I cant blame him at all for choosing to spend his time on his truck.
You guys talk about "community" and "sharing" and act like Robert owes you something. The reverse it true; you owe him understanding and some respect.

 

[ed hess]

Re: Power is back

I am very disappointed. You all have it wrong. Robert is a wonderful SyTy ambassador and you guys bust his balls for not "sharing?" Maybe some sort of penis envy going on here...

I bet his deal is as simple as time management. With limited time/resources I would choose to spend both on my truck, not online. I cant blame him at all for choosing to spend his time on his truck.
You guys talk about "community" and "sharing" and act like Robert owes you something. The reverse it true; you owe him understanding and some respect.

yeah thats what i said.

ed

 

[420]

Re: Power is back

To those bitching about information sharing...

If you ask in the right way (privately, politely, and with specific questions), you will be AMAZED what you can find out. I see a lot of general "Tell me everything you know" questions getting thrown around, and you know what? I'd shut those down too.

Just my $.02

 

[JSM]

Re: Power is back

To those bitching about information sharing...

If you ask in the right way (privately, politely, and with specific questions), you will be AMAZED what you can find out. I see a lot of general "Tell me everything you know" questions getting thrown around, and you know what? I'd shut those down too.

Just my $.02

Lets be honest here, 99.9% of the people here need tips like how to hook up datamaster, why does my truck not run, what size rims do I need, what is the best chip to buy.

Those that are asking "tell me everything you know" most likely don't have any reason besides curiosity to know why anyways..

Those that do plan to go fast, learn to figure it out on their own for the most part, or pick up a phone and make phone calls or research things.

I see it in tuning, everybody wants to order a chip that will make life happy and grand. I guess as a society we are getting lazy, "just give me the information I don't want to spend my time learning for myself". The thing is with chips and the same here. I can give you chips, and in fact we give away lots of chips on code59. But just because we give the chip away it won't make your truck run right, or fast. You will need to tune and figure out what works for you. The EXACT same thing is happening here. Robert could send you a recipe, you you gotta know how to stir it, is your oven the same temp, did the spices come from the same jar? Even then the cookies may taste different.

I have said this before, and generally with a few exceptions it is true. When you get to a point that Robert, Ed Hess, etc are at. What are you going to post on this site besides what you have done the weekend before at the track.

If Ed posted a question asking for help as at 600ft mark his twin turbo's come alive and the tires go up in smoke. Who is going to be able to help. Best answer he will get is "My truck doesn't do that, or I can't duplicate the problem."

Instead he is going to go to the track, talk to Harry whoever he trusts and "figure" it out for himself.

It is really simple, going fast REQUIRES you to figure things out on your own, not just have the answers given to you. If your waiting for someone to give you answers pull up a very comfortable seat. If you want to go fast, get out in the garage and track you will figure it out.

Roberts truck has brought as much or more outside interest and coverage than any other syty IMO. That is a good thing for everybody.

 

[sytyguy]

Re: Power is back

I think of it just like any other creation (physical product, software, etc...). If someone dumps tons of time into something and foots the bill, then they should have every right to withhold information, sell information, etc... If someone wrote a software program to calculate 0-60 in a SyTy and made it completely freeware to the community, would you hound them to provide you with the source code? Or is use of the program enough? I think Robert has provided a similar service. He's pushed the limits, inspired competition, provided tons of video, and given the community a "Premier Truck" to brag/bench race with.....(e.g. - "Yeah, well. The SyTy group has an 8 second truck in it!"). I know a lot of "open source owners" that haven't done a tenth of those things for the community.

I respect Robert and his crew tremendously....and that includes respecting his right to tell us as much or as little as he wants about the EFFORT that HE has poured into HIS truck. Want some info? Ask nicely and hope he obliges. Otherwise, send him a lot of money, become his sponsor, and require him to fill you in on the details. Of course, he still has the right to decline the sponsorship.

 

[420]

Re: Power is back

But...but...but... That's too HARD! :hissyfit:

 

[MikeRenz]

Re: Power is back

and then try reading/answering questions in your non-native tongue. :lol:

The questions being asked aren't prying or invasive, and shouldn't be taken as nagging or hounding. And they weren't asked in a disrespectful way. They were however way too general (e.g. what lessons have you learned along the way?) Some questions roll off the tongue very easily without realizing how difficult it might be to answer.

As for cam specs...unless you're detailing your entire blueprint, and supplying your tune to go along with it...i personally don't understand why everyone is so hush hush about their cam specs. I realize its a race for top dog/bragging rights...and i have no problem with people choosing to withhold information. I just don't understand how withholding cam specs is like the keystone to your build. Can someone explain this to me? Ed? Understand that i'm not criticizing for not sharing the cam specs, just wondering whats so magical that no one ever wants to share.

 

[ed hess]

Re: Power is back

and then try reading/answering questions in your non-native tongue.

As for cam specs...unless you're detailing your entire blueprint, and supplying your tune to go along with it...i personally don't understand why everyone is so hush hush about their cam specs. I realize its a race for top dog/bragging rights...and i have no problem with people choosing to withhold information. I just don't understand how withholding cam specs is like the keystone to your build. Can someone explain this to me? Ed? Understand that i'm not criticizing for not sharing the cam specs, just wondering whats so magical that no one ever wants to share.

mike,

>>>understand how withholding cam specs is like the keystone to your build.

You dont have to understand, you just have to learn to accept it.

>>>just wondering whats so magical that no one ever wants to share.

Do you honestly think robert or myself is going to start swapping tips back and forth? not hardly.

Nothing magical, its just the combination and applying the theories to that combination while testing and tweaking.

But will robert or I give anyone enough to duplicate that combination?

50k and you can have the whole thing, plus 12 months tech support via phone and email. Onsite is available if you bring it here. lo

mike think of it this way... Dont tell the competition anything except for misinformation. lol

remember the intercooler break, everyone was talking aboutboost pressure breeaking it because of 1 sided welding. We knew that was bullshit. Figured it had a n20 backfire. ok so just silently watching the misinformation. next time out the motor takes a shit from the n20 problem. get the picture.

now if it wasnt bullshit then those boys in sweeden need some help, cuz they should have seen it.

Sometimes people just miss the obvious because they spoke instead of silently listening and watching.

Now if you dont say or show anything what does the other guy get.

Nothing!

Its competition and thats racing.

like pulling to the line knowing you cant get down the track cuz your transfer case is busted to the rear but you going to screw around staging to play with the other guy and hope he redlights. same thing but its on the internet instead of the track.

hope this helps but if it doesnt ... get over it. lol

ed

ps, mike stop in i will show you the changes and the theories behind what we hope to get from them.