HEEELLLPPPP Front axle woes?
- Thread starter mototard
- Start date
mototard
New member
Re: HEEELLLPPPP Front axle woes?
Ok heres the verdict. Not the T case it was the front driver side axle. The c clip had lost its tension and on a sharp turn or under torq the axle would walk out out the carrier and out of its splines. I havent driven it much so no damage. I could still see the machining lines on the splines. The C clip was still on the axle shaft and had just collasped letting the axle walk. I managed to get the front diff changed out today with a spare I had. So all is good. Took me from 8 until 5:30 to get it done. Now to rebuild the bad axle. I think I can just replace the C clip but wont know for sure until I open it up. Thanks to TYTILIDIE for figuring his out which made me look at my front axle before replacing the T case.
The way I finally figured out it was the axle and not the T case, I jacked it up and turned the wheels as sharp as they would go (both ways) then took a pry bar and pryed against the lower A arm and the cv/axle flange well the driver side axle popped out about 1" and it didnt have any real resistantce. The pass. side I could put pressure on it and it would move but you could feel the C clip when it bottumed out (only moved about 1/8") When I had the axle out of the truck I pulled the whole driver side axle out by hand. :rant:
Ok heres the verdict. Not the T case it was the front driver side axle. The c clip had lost its tension and on a sharp turn or under torq the axle would walk out out the carrier and out of its splines. I havent driven it much so no damage. I could still see the machining lines on the splines. The C clip was still on the axle shaft and had just collasped letting the axle walk. I managed to get the front diff changed out today with a spare I had. So all is good. Took me from 8 until 5:30 to get it done. Now to rebuild the bad axle. I think I can just replace the C clip but wont know for sure until I open it up. Thanks to TYTILIDIE for figuring his out which made me look at my front axle before replacing the T case.
The way I finally figured out it was the axle and not the T case, I jacked it up and turned the wheels as sharp as they would go (both ways) then took a pry bar and pryed against the lower A arm and the cv/axle flange well the driver side axle popped out about 1" and it didnt have any real resistantce. The pass. side I could put pressure on it and it would move but you could feel the C clip when it bottumed out (only moved about 1/8") When I had the axle out of the truck I pulled the whole driver side axle out by hand. :rant:
Last edited:
Typhoonracer
Old Guard GURU
Re: HEEELLLPPPP Front axle woes?
The Xfer cases are CLOSE Its almost a pullit and compare deal, BUT the good thing is that 99%of the time the case 1/2s are ok...the bearings and bushings are what go bad (and the rare viscous coupling) the rebuild parts are available for the xfer case With or with out a chain...
(if its apart REPLACE THE CHAIN they are reasonable now $100 maybe??)
What you HAVE to watch is the output shaft!!! The out put shaft and yoke on a SY is the same as a Turbo 350 trans, The TY has the same size as a turbo 400 I dont remember the # of splines off the top of my head...
A Barvada "should" work....A xfer case from a AWD astro van MAY work (I had to machinf the front cover to make mine fit the tranny...
I have X-fer case parts around if needed...just ask...just pay shipping!!
The Xfer cases are CLOSE Its almost a pullit and compare deal, BUT the good thing is that 99%of the time the case 1/2s are ok...the bearings and bushings are what go bad (and the rare viscous coupling) the rebuild parts are available for the xfer case With or with out a chain...
(if its apart REPLACE THE CHAIN they are reasonable now $100 maybe??)
What you HAVE to watch is the output shaft!!! The out put shaft and yoke on a SY is the same as a Turbo 350 trans, The TY has the same size as a turbo 400 I dont remember the # of splines off the top of my head...
A Barvada "should" work....A xfer case from a AWD astro van MAY work (I had to machinf the front cover to make mine fit the tranny...
I have X-fer case parts around if needed...just ask...just pay shipping!!
mototard
New member
Re: HEEELLLPPPP Front axle woes?
Just looked at the 2 T cases side by side. The bravada has the same numbers 4472 as the Sy, the only difference I can find is that the tail pieces are different. The Bravada's is about 1" longer than the Sy's. But the Sy's drive shaft is 1 3/8" longer than the Bravada's. Weird?? Haven't checked the splines yet, figured they would be the same so I didnt check. Plus it was getting late and the damn thing has kicked my ass. If you had to use a bravada T case the easiest thing would be to cut drive shaft. If the splines are different cut both drive shafts to build one. Either way it looks like a 94 Bravada T case isnt a direct bolt in, but pretty easy and cheap to make it work. Bravada has 3.73 gears so an axle swap would take both axles or a ring and pinion change out.
Just looked at the 2 T cases side by side. The bravada has the same numbers 4472 as the Sy, the only difference I can find is that the tail pieces are different. The Bravada's is about 1" longer than the Sy's. But the Sy's drive shaft is 1 3/8" longer than the Bravada's. Weird?? Haven't checked the splines yet, figured they would be the same so I didnt check. Plus it was getting late and the damn thing has kicked my ass. If you had to use a bravada T case the easiest thing would be to cut drive shaft. If the splines are different cut both drive shafts to build one. Either way it looks like a 94 Bravada T case isnt a direct bolt in, but pretty easy and cheap to make it work. Bravada has 3.73 gears so an axle swap would take both axles or a ring and pinion change out.
Last edited:
Typhoonracer
Old Guard GURU
Re: HEEELLLPPPP Front axle woes?
ok
The "gear ratio" is determined by the front and rear diff gear set NOT the Xfer case...
Then what you should do is rebuild your X-fer case....put in a new chain, bearings, seals, and bushings....this way there is no doubt that it will fit with out cutting anything up...
http://nationaldrivetrain.com/shopsite_sc/store/html/tcasebear.html
Boeg Warner 1372/4472 X-fer case bearing and seal kit $82.00
http://nationaldrivetrain.com/shopsite_sc/store/html/t_case_chains.html
Borg Warner 1372/4472 Xfer case Chain $94.95 (1 blue link)
Under $250 and you are set!
I have a spare out put shaft bushing and output seal for a SY as the one in the kit will not fit the TY If you want it its yours.... Just pay shipping.....
ok
The "gear ratio" is determined by the front and rear diff gear set NOT the Xfer case...
Then what you should do is rebuild your X-fer case....put in a new chain, bearings, seals, and bushings....this way there is no doubt that it will fit with out cutting anything up...
http://nationaldrivetrain.com/shopsite_sc/store/html/tcasebear.html
Boeg Warner 1372/4472 X-fer case bearing and seal kit $82.00
http://nationaldrivetrain.com/shopsite_sc/store/html/t_case_chains.html
Borg Warner 1372/4472 Xfer case Chain $94.95 (1 blue link)
Under $250 and you are set!
I have a spare out put shaft bushing and output seal for a SY as the one in the kit will not fit the TY If you want it its yours.... Just pay shipping.....
mototard
New member
Re: HEEELLLPPPP Front axle woes?
Yes a rebuild is the way to go. I was just stating the differences in the Bravada and Sy if some one was in a bind and had a Bravada T case. And was just noting that the Bravada I have has 3.73 instead ot the SY/TY 3.42's. So if you did have to use one you'd have to use both. Wondering what the 3.73's would be like? Figure that with the 3.73 engine speed would be up a good bit at highway speeds. Probably be a blast red light to red light though.
I'll take the spacer and seal. Let me know what shipping will be to 35406. Do you take pay pal?
Yes a rebuild is the way to go. I was just stating the differences in the Bravada and Sy if some one was in a bind and had a Bravada T case. And was just noting that the Bravada I have has 3.73 instead ot the SY/TY 3.42's. So if you did have to use one you'd have to use both. Wondering what the 3.73's would be like? Figure that with the 3.73 engine speed would be up a good bit at highway speeds. Probably be a blast red light to red light though.
I'll take the spacer and seal. Let me know what shipping will be to 35406. Do you take pay pal?
Typhoonracer
Old Guard GURU
Re: HEEELLLPPPP Front axle woes?
Ok I will get them out of the garage...
I will get shipping $$ for you.
Ok I will get them out of the garage...
I will get shipping $$ for you.
mototard
New member
Re: HEEELLLPPPP Front axle woes?
Yes it fixed it.
Ended up using a bravada front axle 3.73 so I went ahead and switch out the rear too. Dont think I like the 3.73s to much. Should have just waited and rebuilt the 3.42. The 3.73 raised my RPMs by about 400 rpms higher at 70mph. I'll rebuild the front 3.42 diff and with todays gas prices, back with the 3.42 would be better plus lowering my rpms back to normal. Also a weird one was the rear Bravada axle had ABS sensers but no rear ABS wires to the axle. Guess someone changed it out before. But better yet I had a set of fiebird aluminum drums I'd been wanting to turn down to fit but the Bravada backing plate were different and the aluminum drums worked with out any mods. Must be a axle off a camaro but it had leaf spring perches that didnt look like they had been changed. Leaf spring perches and ABS sensers. Strange???
Typhoonracer
Let me know what I owe you and ship them to
Allen Roach
5516 New Watermelon Rd.
Tuscaloosa, Al. 35406
Yes it fixed it.
Ended up using a bravada front axle 3.73 so I went ahead and switch out the rear too. Dont think I like the 3.73s to much. Should have just waited and rebuilt the 3.42. The 3.73 raised my RPMs by about 400 rpms higher at 70mph. I'll rebuild the front 3.42 diff and with todays gas prices, back with the 3.42 would be better plus lowering my rpms back to normal. Also a weird one was the rear Bravada axle had ABS sensers but no rear ABS wires to the axle. Guess someone changed it out before. But better yet I had a set of fiebird aluminum drums I'd been wanting to turn down to fit but the Bravada backing plate were different and the aluminum drums worked with out any mods. Must be a axle off a camaro but it had leaf spring perches that didnt look like they had been changed. Leaf spring perches and ABS sensers. Strange???
Typhoonracer
Let me know what I owe you and ship them to
Allen Roach
5516 New Watermelon Rd.
Tuscaloosa, Al. 35406
Last edited:
mototard
New member
Re: HEEELLLPPPP Front axle woes?
The axle (not CV) is held into the side gear (inside diff.) It has a groove machined into the axle which a spring steel "c clip" is susposed to hold the axle from walking out of the diff. In my case the C clip lost tension and let the axle walk out of the gear. The axle fits into the gear with splines. If I'd turn sharp or when under torq the axle would walk out of the splines/gear making a horrible clunking clicking sound and I could actually feel it slipping (truck lurching) I'll try and take a few pics of it.
Here is the axle (driver side) Notice the C clip, it is not broke just lost tension letting the axle walk out of the diff. Its not really a C clip like in the rear axle. Its more like a spring steel ring ( like what holds a socket on an impact gun ). Looks like the axle is installed with the c clip on it, not like a normal c clip which is installed on the axle once it is in the carrier, thats why it is spring steel and almost a full circle. I think.
Looking in side the diff. You can see that the splines are only about 1" long so turning sharp the CV half shafts will pull on the C clip causing it to fail. The C clip is susposed to lock the axle into the side gear.
Complete axle.
The axle (not CV) is held into the side gear (inside diff.) It has a groove machined into the axle which a spring steel "c clip" is susposed to hold the axle from walking out of the diff. In my case the C clip lost tension and let the axle walk out of the gear. The axle fits into the gear with splines. If I'd turn sharp or when under torq the axle would walk out of the splines/gear making a horrible clunking clicking sound and I could actually feel it slipping (truck lurching) I'll try and take a few pics of it.
Here is the axle (driver side) Notice the C clip, it is not broke just lost tension letting the axle walk out of the diff. Its not really a C clip like in the rear axle. Its more like a spring steel ring ( like what holds a socket on an impact gun ). Looks like the axle is installed with the c clip on it, not like a normal c clip which is installed on the axle once it is in the carrier, thats why it is spring steel and almost a full circle. I think.
Looking in side the diff. You can see that the splines are only about 1" long so turning sharp the CV half shafts will pull on the C clip causing it to fail. The C clip is susposed to lock the axle into the side gear.
Complete axle.
Last edited:
mototard
New member
Re: HEEELLLPPPP Front axle woes?
You should be able to tell if your axle has bad clips without taking the whole axle apart. Put the front up on jack stands then I took a long pry bar and put it behind the axle flange (where axle and cv bolts together) I then had someone turn the wheel full sharp to the left then to the right as I put pressure against the flange (prying against the axle flange across the a frame). On the passenger side when I put pressure the axle would move about 3/16" and kinda spring back (I could bounce the axle against the c clip), I could feel the c clip doing its job. On the driver side the axle had no bounce when pryed against and it would move about 1/2" but it didnt spring back it just moved then I'd have to push it back in. I then unbolted the cv from the axle and pryed again and the whole driver side axle popped out.
I have the part # on the c clip. Any auto parts should have it just trying to make the idiots behind the counter understand what your talking about was worse than replacing the axle.
I'll find the part # and post it later on today. Its the same part # as any 1st gen. S series 4x4
You should be able to tell if your axle has bad clips without taking the whole axle apart. Put the front up on jack stands then I took a long pry bar and put it behind the axle flange (where axle and cv bolts together) I then had someone turn the wheel full sharp to the left then to the right as I put pressure against the flange (prying against the axle flange across the a frame). On the passenger side when I put pressure the axle would move about 3/16" and kinda spring back (I could bounce the axle against the c clip), I could feel the c clip doing its job. On the driver side the axle had no bounce when pryed against and it would move about 1/2" but it didnt spring back it just moved then I'd have to push it back in. I then unbolted the cv from the axle and pryed again and the whole driver side axle popped out.
I have the part # on the c clip. Any auto parts should have it just trying to make the idiots behind the counter understand what your talking about was worse than replacing the axle.
I'll find the part # and post it later on today. Its the same part # as any 1st gen. S series 4x4
mototard
New member
Re: HEEELLLPPPP Front axle woes?
I posted pics of the driver side. It will look exactly the same except the axle will be about 18" longer. So atleast you know what your looking at.
GM # is14041989 and they call it a snap ring and it cost a whooping $5.00 Wish it was a simple fix.
I posted pics of the driver side. It will look exactly the same except the axle will be about 18" longer. So atleast you know what your looking at.
GM # is14041989 and they call it a snap ring and it cost a whooping $5.00 Wish it was a simple fix.
Re: HEEELLLPPPP Front axle woes?
Help!
I can get the axle to slide out just an inch or so but the snap ring seems to be holding it in place. How do I get the stub shaft out if that ring is in place? All I've seen is to pry it out. BFH?
This it the stub shaft that's in the housing that goes into the pass side of the diff.
Thx
Help!
I can get the axle to slide out just an inch or so but the snap ring seems to be holding it in place. How do I get the stub shaft out if that ring is in place? All I've seen is to pry it out. BFH?
This it the stub shaft that's in the housing that goes into the pass side of the diff.
Thx