95 4L80e

swoop

under contruction...
So I happened to stumble across this 4L80e out of a 95 6.5 2500 pickup, very VERY cheap and supposedly it was working flawlessly when it was in. are all the 4L80e's the same? I was going to rebuild the 700 but this seems to make more sense, George how much is just the conversion parts and will this one work?
 

QUICK STORM

B.A.M.F. BMW Tech
Re: 95 4L80e

i would search his vender forum, has all the answers you need. i would definately build that 80e up.
 

swoop

under contruction...
Re: 95 4L80e

yea, well basically i was going to keep it stock for now considering a stock 4L80 is much better than a stock 700. is the conversion kit really 1k?
 

George Blake

DONATING MEMBER
Re: 95 4L80e

$1315 for the complete changeover kit.
Linkage bracket to use stock shifter cable
Crossmember
Brace extensions
Syty output shaft with cryo
Short manual shift shaft
Lokar Flexible Dipstick firewall mount
Steel adaptor plate
6 bolts for adaptor plate

This leaves nothing else to buy if you already have a 4L80e and just want to put it in and have your driveshafts done locally. I sell the front prop ready to go for $403.

This is everything that you will need to mechanically make it fit. Yes, that's the price. Like I said, guys won't flinch at $6K and up for an engine....they'll spend $1500 just on a turbo, but they think a trans is an $800 job. This stuff is expensive to make and have done due to the quantities we're talking about. You can't just go to Jeg's or Summit and get it.

Do yourself a favor and install a Transgo HD2 kit. There are MANY safety upgrades in the kit as well as clutch pack capacity increases due to lube and apply mods.
 

#2875

built, not bought
Re: 95 4L80e

do you have a turbo? looking at your sig i was unsure and thought i would ask. is the 49 installed?

swoop said:
yea, well basically i was going to keep it stock for now considering a stock 4L80 is much better than a stock 700. is the conversion kit really 1k?
 

swoop

under contruction...
Re: 95 4L80e

i have the factory turbo installed now, my friend is completly re-doing is grand national and im getting the ta49. hes got it bored 30 over, forged everything, new exhaust, caged, its a big time deal hes lookin to get low 11s when its all said and done.
 
Re: 95 4L80e

George Blake said:
$1315 for the complete changeover kit.
Linkage bracket to use stock shifter cable
Crossmember
Brace extensions
Syty output shaft with cryo
Short manual shift shaft
Lokar Flexible Dipstick firewall mount
Steel adaptor plate
6 bolts for adaptor plate

This leaves nothing else to buy if you already have a 4L80e and just want to put it in and have your driveshafts done locally. I sell the front prop ready to go for $403.

This is everything that you will need to mechanically make it fit. Yes, that's the price. Like I said, guys won't flinch at $6K and up for an engine....they'll spend $1500 just on a turbo, but they think a trans is an $800 job. This stuff is expensive to make and have done due to the quantities we're talking about. You can't just go to Jeg's or Summit and get it.

Do yourself a favor and install a Transgo HD2 kit. There are MANY safety upgrades in the kit as well as clutch pack capacity increases due to lube and apply mods.


I thought that the complete changeover kit came with the TCI trans controller also? Along with the longer gilbert front propshaft, and the only thing needed was to have our stock rear shaft shortened 3in? Which can be done locally.
 

JSM

Active member
Re: 95 4L80e

I wish I could get the price lower. It just isn't possible.

George has gone through a couple machine shops that couldn't spline the shafts properly to his liking. Most shops want to soften them before machining. Just the shaft alone is ~$200. Controller on George's GP was $550.

That leaves you an adaptor plate, shift linkage bracket, crossmember, transfer case brace extension. All custom pieces for our trucks.

No doubt the 80e is expensive and George and myself are doing what we can to make it as affordable and bolt in operation for everybody. In the end it is custom.

Heck call around to machine shops and ask them how much to machine down, and respline just the output shaft. I suspect you will find it is a fair amount more than George is charging. If it is less, let me know when they build you one correctly. I have more to order.
 

George Blake

DONATING MEMBER
Re: 95 4L80e

There are many different combinations. That price above only includes those componets. Some guys want a Big Stuff 3, Some want a PCS, Some want the TCI, that's why those aren't included in the price. That's specific in that thread.

The front prop is also available. Some guys want them done locally, so it's not automatically included.

Read the the pricing carefully. The TCI controller alone is $650. Big stuff is $1000's depending on what you want.
 

swoop

under contruction...
Re: 95 4L80e

It seems to be the best idea to get the 4L80e and buy the conversion just for comfort in knowing you have a solid drivetrain and wont be popping 700s left and right. But I didnt realize how quickly everything was going to add up cost wise. In the long run it might be worth it, but I was looking to get everything ready to drive fairly soon. This is a tough decision though, new turbo, heads, exhaust, and trans are all getting done. With all the power this will be making it might be worth it to do the swap and just wait it out so its plenty good to race. I'm definitly having a tough time on this.
 

George Blake

DONATING MEMBER
Re: 95 4L80e

When guys like yourself start setting the truck up to race, you've got to budget accordingly. We break a LOT more trans than engines. Before you buy the turbo, before your start hunting a $2300 4340 crank, fix the problem areas. The trans and the front prop shaft. Those are what we break with STOCK trucks. A "built" 700 will may be all you need....the first time you launch, you may bust it. That's the drawback to the 700. Better yet, since your already having the trans done(700 I assume), work on your driveability tuning. That's what you'll be doing most of the time anyway, right? Take it easy on it. At least you'll be able to sell the trans when your done. A busted 700 is worth $15 at the scrapyard.
 

George Blake

DONATING MEMBER
Re: 95 4L80e

In your situation, you already have a good 4L80E to start with.
$650 for the controller.
$1350 for the complete transmission hardware kit.
$110 for the Transgo HD2 kit.
$2110 total.

If you do the TCI controller, you will need a TOSS signal. You get this from the reluctor wheel under rearmost sensor of the trans. A 4x4 4L80e won't have one and you'll need the sonnax part. If you have a 2wd unit, it will have it already.


These are things you need BUT they are things you NEED to buy even if you DIDN'T do the 4L80e:
$950 for a billet converter. This one is more expensive because the hardware to make it handle WOT lockups REPEATEDLY. You need it anyway if your gonna race. Cheaper models are available if you disable WOT lockup.

$403 for a Gilbert 4L80e front prop with new seal and bolts. You need a Gilbert anyway. There have been MANY people bust the front driveshaft with stock trucks. This takes out the shifter cable, wire harness, trans case....if you lucky, it will just bounce off the floor.

Mine is a little more for the Gilbert because the front pinion seal will leak if you don't replace it, so I include it, and the rear bolts usually have the heads stripped out from previous work, so I include bolts just like the ones Mike Campbell sells.

$1353 for driveline items that you need anyway but HAVE to do when you do the 4L80E.
 

swoop

under contruction...
Re: 95 4L80e

God damn this keeps gettin deeper and deeper. It makes sense to do it right the first time, but at the rate it would go if I did the 4L80e I wouldnt be driving the truck till who knows when. The truck is only going to be a weekend driver, and I'm not going to race it everyday. Is the 700 really THAT weak that it couldnt handle a few times every now and then at the strip or the occasional stoplight? And what about afterwords with the turbo, exhaust, heads etc...
 

#2875

built, not bought
Re: 95 4L80e

i've been doing just that for a couple of years now except mine has been a daily driver... until i finish the chevelle.

swoop said:
God damn this keeps gettin deeper and deeper. It makes sense to do it right the first time, but at the rate it would go if I did the 4L80e I wouldnt be driving the truck till who knows when. The truck is only going to be a weekend driver, and I'm not going to race it everyday. Is the 700 really THAT weak that it couldnt handle a few times every now and then at the strip or the occasional stoplight? And what about afterwords with the turbo, exhaust, heads etc...
 

George Blake

DONATING MEMBER
Re: 95 4L80e

I just realized you only had 42 posts. We've been putting up with the 700 for YEARS. Rear planetaries, sprags, input drum, aluminum forward pistons, outputshaft, sprag, reaction carrier shaft, overrun clutch hub, you name it we've broke it.
 

'JustDreamin'

Dream: 6LV8 Turbo Bravada
Re: 95 4L80e

swoop said:
God damn this keeps gettin deeper and deeper. It makes sense to do it right the first time, but at the rate it would go if I did the 4L80e I wouldnt be driving the truck till who knows when. The truck is only going to be a weekend driver, and I'm not going to race it everyday. Is the 700 really THAT weak that it couldnt handle a few times every now and then at the strip or the occasional stoplight? And what about afterwords with the turbo, exhaust, heads etc...

I'm going to throw something out here, just as an option to consider.....

How often will you drive this truck on the street? Really, what I'm asking is do you really need overdrive? If not, you could do a TH400 3speed. That trans is significantly cheaper to build for big horsepower, doesn't need the controller, and doesn't need a lockup converter. But this would be a pretty much race only setup. With no overdrive, you'll spin the motor pretty good to run down the highway at 70mph.


So, basically you've got 3 options:
1.) Put a 700R4 in it, hope it stays together, throw money at it when it breaks (not if, just when). Least amount of money now, but also the least reliable and most unpredictable.
2.) Put a TH400 in it, don't drive it on the street as a daily driver. More money than the 700R4, but less than the 80E. Will be plenty strong, but you loose driveability.
3.) Put a 4L80E in it, drive it wherever and whenever you please, and don't worry about breaking it to speak of (its possible, but pretty hard). Yes, you'll spend a fair bit of money now, but it'll be the only way to make it a reliable truck that you can run on the highway without running 3500rpm at 70mph (my guess).

That pretty much summarizes the options. None of them are great (the 80E is a great solution but hammers the wallet pretty good) but that's the way it is. You've got to pick the option that fills YOUR needs the best. And maybe you need a running truck now and don't have the $5k (or whatever the total is) to drop on an 80E. Only you can figure that out.

'JustDreamin'
 

#2875

built, not bought
Re: 95 4L80e

good ideas. what about option 4: TH400 with 308 gears?




JustDreamin said:
I'm going to throw something out here, just as an option to consider.....

How often will you drive this truck on the street? Really, what I'm asking is do you really need overdrive? If not, you could do a TH400 3speed. That trans is significantly cheaper to build for big horsepower, doesn't need the controller, and doesn't need a lockup converter. But this would be a pretty much race only setup. With no overdrive, you'll spin the motor pretty good to run down the highway at 70mph.


So, basically you've got 3 options:
1.) Put a 700R4 in it, hope it stays together, throw money at it when it breaks (not if, just when). Least amount of money now, but also the least reliable and most unpredictable.
2.) Put a TH400 in it, don't drive it on the street as a daily driver. More money than the 700R4, but less than the 80E. Will be plenty strong, but you loose driveability.
3.) Put a 4L80E in it, drive it wherever and whenever you please, and don't worry about breaking it to speak of (its possible, but pretty hard). Yes, you'll spend a fair bit of money now, but it'll be the only way to make it a reliable truck that you can run on the highway without running 3500rpm at 70mph (my guess).

That pretty much summarizes the options. None of them are great (the 80E is a great solution but hammers the wallet pretty good) but that's the way it is. You've got to pick the option that fills YOUR needs the best. And maybe you need a running truck now and don't have the $5k (or whatever the total is) to drop on an 80E. Only you can figure that out.

'JustDreamin'
 

George Blake

DONATING MEMBER
Re: 95 4L80e

good ideas. what about option 4: TH400 with 308 gears?
Nolan from Campbell automotive did this, and I think Ed Hess is running a 400. Ask either of them what they think. Best way to get it is from someone using it.:tup:
 

'JustDreamin'

Dream: 6LV8 Turbo Bravada
Re: 95 4L80e

I think Ed Hess is running a TH400 and 3.08's.....And likes it....Like his truck needs less gear ratio to work against, thereby loading the engine (and turbo) up harder.


One of the detriments to Option 4 is the cost. The cost of swapping gearsets front and rear can get to be high (especially if you include all new bearings, gears, a decent limited slip for the rear, labor to set it up right).

Then you start thinking about that weak A$$ 7.5" / 7.625" rear axle with a lousy limited slip and going "why would I want to dump money into that?". You think to yourself "I really ought to upgrade that to at least a 8.5" 10 bolt, if not something heavier duty, like a 12-bolt / 9" / Dana 60, with a decent limited slip / locker and maybe even upgraded axles (with C-clip eliminators) before I break it at the track and wreck the truck (look at Ed Hess' sig pic for an example of what happens when you break an axle when running C-clips).

I'm not going to say that putting a better axle under the truck is a bad idea nor will I say that swapping gears is impractical or super expensive. But, by the time you look at the trans and the axle swaps, you're probably spending the same money as you would have on an 80E, and you still don't have the level of streetability as you would with the 80E. But for some folks, it will be a viable option as it fills their needs the best.

'JustDreamin'
 
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